Unfairness Of Pay By The Hour And The Fair Labor Act

Daniel, I'm just too tired tonight to go through your post and show all the illogical thought in it, but it needs to be addressed. You really don't think too well of trucker's intelligence if you really believe some of what you stated. After I'm rested I will be back in here.

Daniel, I'm just too tired tonight to go through your post and show all the illogical thought in it, but it needs to be addressed. You really don't think too well of trucker's intelligence if you really believe some of what you stated. After I'm rested I will be back in here.

I was going to respond, but I will definitely let old school handle this one.

Americans tend to work on average wayyyyy more than most countries.

Daniel, I'm not sure how many other countries you've ever been to, but I don't think you really understand how things are around the world these days. I have a friend in Greece, and a friend in France who are in management positions - they are both headed home to the states due to the economic problems in both of those places. If your premise is correct, and for the most part I don't think it is, you should certainly realize that Americans are also "wayyyyy" more prosperous than the folks in most countries. Have you ever noticed how often we have truck drivers from over seas in our forum wanting to know how they can come here and get one of our trucking jobs? Yeah, I have, and it is almost always because they say how professional and safe our industry is, and how much more we get paid than they do.

If you went to any other country and told them you worked 70 hours a week at a skilled profession and made less than a living wage (17 or 18 an hour on average, depends on your state) with minimal benefits, they would think you were crazy.

I honestly think that they would think you are crazy for considering 17 or 18 or even 7 or 8 dollars an hour less than a living wage. I have a friend who recently returned from China who met good hardworking folks who were putting in as much as 85 - 90 hours a week in factory jobs where they were forced to live on the premises in company provided housing. They were getting paid the equivalent of about 35 American dollars per week!

The reason truckers get paid by the mile is because that looks better to someone who doesn't know the industry.

I am curious where you got that little piece of wisdom. Is that your own little bit of insider knowledge, and if it is, then how in the world were you drawn in to this deceitful industry when you already knew how the movers and shakers in this business were tricking people to join up with this very deceitful tactic?

Do you think people would be so excited to pay thousands of dollars to work a 10 an hour job if they knew that's what it was? We'd have much less people going to CDL school, and driver pay would go up.

While I find it difficult to follow all of your various statements, this one really confuses me. Most people get in this industry with little or no upfront expense by going through Company-Sponsored Training . The ones who "pay thousands of dollars" choose that path even though there are less expensive ways to get on board. This industry has spared many a family who was on the verge of bankruptcy and or even homelessness. Can you name for me some other industry that you can go to school for only about four weeks, spend what I consider a small amount of money to start a new career, and then be bombarded with job offers where a rookie with some gumption has the potential to make about fifty grand his first year. This has been my personal experience, I realize not everyone does that well, but the potential is there for the type of person who understand that mileage pay is incentive pay, not some form of pay that is designed to keep you down. Trucking companies love the drivers who recognize this truth, and reward them with what I call "the good stuff." Your average driver who takes the attitude that the company is trying to keep his earnings low so they don't have to pay him very much ends up fulfilling his own prophecies.

Trucking is a special job that requires a whole different mind set than most jobs. We often refer to it as a lifestyle, there is good reason for that. You just can't compare it to hourly jobs. In this business it is all about moving freight, and the guys who are successful understand that it is also about moving the most freight. Your ideas about safety just don't add up. Mileage pay is designed to help bring the cream to the top, it separates the professional from the strugglers. The professional realizes he may need to change his route, or start a little earlier when there is inclement weather, he doesn't sweat the fact that it will take him more time, he just wants to get the load delivered safely and on time because that puts him in position to be available for the next load. Mileage pay does not push the professional to try to increase his speed, it pushes him to plan better and execute better. Each time I make a delivery, one of the most influential things I am considering is how to do it so that I am ready for the next load in a timely manner so that I can end up getting the best loads. It doesn't make me drive unsafely, it makes me drive smarter.

Continued...

Of course none of this will change until a protest or strike happens, which is unlikely since most drivers are used to cpm and unfortunately aren't the best at math.

Truck drivers need to be good at math, and many of them are. I don't know how a driver can survive out here without having some math skills. How do you calculate the percentage of the weight of your fuel that is being transferred to your axles on your tractor, or how much weight you are losing as you burn off fuel as you run down the road? How do you know how many holes to slide your tandems to balance your load, or in the case of the flat-bedders how many chains do you need on that load or how many feet do you need in between those straps so that yo are legal? How long will it take you to make that delivery if you have to route yourself around a closed mountain pass. Will it be better for you to sit and wait for the pass to open, or will it be better to drive some extra miles so that you can deliver and then move on to the next load?

There are a thousand different things everyday that you will need to be able to put some numbers to so that you can be a top performer. I love this stuff, and I actually am quite fond of mileage pay. I am not a slave to it, I am it's master - I feel the same way about running my e-logs, I am in control of those logs, I make sure they serve my purpose instead of me being a slave to the regulations. When a driver begins to understand how to make this stuff work for him, he can make some good money. Will he have some frustrating days? Sure, but for the most part he will be a success story right there in the midst of a bunch of people who will never understand how to make it work.

People in the US work way more hours than other countries...?? I have to laugh at this (not at you)....because you couldn't be more wrong. Many countries don't even know what taking time off for vacation is. Personal days? No such thing. They work every single day in their lives, and only "take a day off" when they get very sick or there is some other type of emergency. Also, these same people don't make more money than we do, they often don't make enough to have all the bare necessities.

I know this....and I have not even traveled the world.

Daniel wrote:

Trucking is a skilled profession. It isn't classified that way, but we know it is. It can take years to master just backing, let alone everything else. So let's put this in perspective here. Americans tend to work on average wayyyyy more than most countries. If you went to any other country and told them you worked 70 hours a week at a skilled profession and made less than a living wage (17 or 18 an hour on average, depends on your state) with minimal benefits, they would think you were crazy. The reason truckers get paid by the mile is because that looks better to someone who doesn't know the industry. Do you think people would be so excited to pay thousands of dollars to work a 10 an hour job if they knew that's what it was? We'd have much less people going to CDL school, and driver pay would go up. Once you have your CDL, your in the pond so to speak, so you swim. CPM puts incentive on speed too. Bad idea in the winter time. (the faster your mph; the more miles; the more $); quite unsafe. Of course none of this will change until a protest or strike happens, which is unlikely since most drivers are used to cpm and unfortunately aren't the best at math. 70 hours a week at $20 an hr WITH overtime (why do we NOT deserve overtime?) equals $$$$$$1700$$$$$$. Did you make that last week?

Daniel aren't you the same person trying to get back into a driver's job (quit, been out of trucking for 3 months)? I am trying to understand if you actually believe what you wrote, why on earth would you want to re-enter the trucking industry? Just curious, cause I sense a significant level of negativity in the above reply.

I am sure you will try, but you really can't formulate a logical argument against what Old School wrote. it's spot on. And trust me I am old enough to remember the last time there were widespread trucker strikes during the fuel crises of the 70's. Be careful what you wish for...

Daniel Sage, we have occasionally had some troublemakers here who tended to insult other members. I finally had the chance to read your whole anti-Trucker screed.

You may not have done it on purpose, but you have done a royal job of insulting many, all at once, describing truck drivers as stupid and easily exploited.

There are several military vets here, some are retired lifers. Also law enforcement officers, people with MBAs, and ex-school teachers. I'll say you're assumptions are wrong.

I could say more, but my 30 minutes are up.

Daniel Sage, we have occasionally had some troublemakers here who tended to insult other members. I finally had the chance to read your whole anti-Trucker screed.

You may not have done it on purpose, but you have done a royal job of insulting many, all at once, describing truck drivers as stupid and easily exploited.

There are several military vets here, some are retired lifers. Also law enforcement officers, people with MBAs, and ex-school teachers. I'll say you're assumptions are wrong.

I could say more, but my 30 minutes are up.

Agreed!

Personally, I have 2.5 degrees. My wife's brother who drives for Southwestern, has a Master's in accounting. (He really hated his banking job). I am reasonably sure he is very good at math, contrary to your (Daniel's) Ill informed opinion/belief.

People from ALL walks of life come to trucking, for one reason or another. Your generalities are definitely off base, at best.

I have a few years of College education under my belt and have been a business owner for years. You're right on Errol, I don't really see any stupid truckers on here. And being intelligent doesn't only come from people having a college education anyway.

I have no college but even I know that 2+2=5.